A new post for JDS, to educate those of us who are hungry for more knowledge in addition to an awesome Seder
I am completely confused regarding Passover and Unleavened Bread. This is my first P/O.
Granted I need to study this some more, but walk me through how you understand it.
1) When do we know when “the aviv†is and who currently makes that call?
2) It seems as though there are multiple schools of thought. Unleavened bread appears to be 7 days, does that include P/O (7 days) or not (8 days)?
3) Is the Unleavened Bread Feast the Passover Seder? Is this on the 15th?
4) Y’shua died on the afternoon of the 14th correct?
5) The last supper was a preparation meal on the evening of the 14th correct (night before his crucifiction)
6) When is the Sabbaths of this period? 14th or 15th? 21st or 22nd?
7) Y’shua and the disciples ate leavened bread at the last supper. Was this before the evening and therefore the 13th, and therefore eating bread with leaven was still permissable b/c it was still daylight? …or, had the sun gone down, yet P/O is not counted in the 7 days of not eating bread with leaven in it.
I will be testing everything you guys state to scripture of course, but some discussion on this would be appreciated. I would like to obey YHWH’s instruction as He intended the best that I know how…
Comments
No assertions and no dessertions (sp?) from the Word
My, that is welcome for us today.
Alright, thanks everbody(the crowd) for that wonderful sangin’
Now, The Luke 24 question, is it chalked up to the other writers were just more accurate with the sequence of the days and the Feast?
Translators mucking the water, again?
Thanks for the clarification family.
Yeah,…. the sangin’ was O.K.
Larry,
That link looks great! Thanks brother.
We are having crock-pot roast and vegs. and pearled barley–the fresh hot flatbreads goes well.
Hi Duncan – Happy Birthday. I’m only 2 ahead of you – mine’s coming up in May. Re the Luke 24, I checked it out on blueletterbible.org – both the Textus Receptus and the mGNT (based on Westcott-Hort) seem to say “the third day since these things happened”. At least, the root word is “third” but my Greek is not good enough to parse the tense, mood etc.
It does seem to contradict what we know to have been the sequence both prophesied (the “sign of the prophet Jonah” – 3 days and 3 nights) and it could be due to a difference in reckoning time between Greek and Hebrew mindsets (remember, Luke was a gentile and his gospel was likely written in Greek, unlike Matthew and John).
I doubt that Luke would have gotten his facts wrong, but the text may well have been altered (edited, “corrected”) by later redactors to suit their particular theological bent. We don’t know, because there are no original autographs left – all we have are many fragments of manuscripts from different locations and times that have been used to piece together the text as it allegedly was.
Unfortunately I don’t have the reference tools to be able to research it in any depth. I wish I could give a more definitive answer. Maybe someone else can shed some light.
One thing I can say for certain though; Yeshua was in the tomb for 3 days and 3 nights, exactly as He said He would be. If anything seems to contradict that, it needs to be treated with caution.
Thank you Rodney,
Ageed, we have come to that same conclusion.
Scot, The media gallery is working well
Shalom
Praise Abba!!!
Can you restate what you and Rodney are discussing? What does it seem to indicate to you?
Scot,
We are looking at Luke 24 with Cleopus referring to it being the third day since these things happend. The pattern of the Pesach and feast indicate already the days of the happenings (death, burial, resurrection, three days and three nights), so we conclude from the origins of these fulfilled promises to be content with not knowing why it “seems” Cleopus or Luke did’nt add correctly.
As Rodney stated ” maybe someone can shed some more light “.
Shabbat Shalom
Duncan\Rodney,
A day off? Are you thinking it should be 4? We need to look at the language a little closer.
No, no extra day. It must be a language misunderstanding. In the 21rst verse Cleopas is talking with Y’shua and says ” today is the third day since these things happend….”
then Cleopas says ” and this morning, some of the women astounded us. They were at the tomb early and could’nt find his body…”
It just seems like Cleopus is saying they are in the third day?
Cleopus —>>>>> Cleopas
Duncan/Scot,
Every reference I have at my disposal has the Greek rendering as “triton” which is definitely “third”. I’ve been doing some rough sketches and I have a possible solution that I don’t like very much (because it messes with what I thought was a pretty solid timeline) but doesn’t seem to require violating any of the other texts or requirements (except a slight re-evaluation of one part of one apparent layer of Daniel’s seventy weeks prophecy). Confused yet?
The possible explanation relies on a difference between Hebrew and Greek reckoning of time.
First, recall that Yeshua said that He would be in the grave for 3 days and 3 nights.
Second, remember that in Hebrew thought one day can mean any period of time that crosses the boundary of one day to the next day. In other words, if I am in a particular location for 25 hours, it would be valid for me to say that I am there for 2 days, because the period of time that I’m there crosses over 2 days. In fact, 25 days could even be 3 days if it was 30 minutes of the first day, 24 hours of the second and 30 minutes of the third. We see a similar issue when Sha’ul writes in Galatians that he went to Arabia for “3 years”. We don’t know exactly how long this is because Sha’ul is a Hebrew and he could mean any period of time from 367 days to 3 full years. All we know is that he was there for at least one full year plus an indeterminate extra period of time beyond that.
Now, before you get too far ahead, I’m not conceding a Friday crucifixion because you cannot deal with 3 days and 3 nights that way and still get it between Friday and Sunday. It is impossible. The best you can do is 3 and 2.
However, if the 14th of the month occurred on a Thursday rather than a Wednesday (meaning the 10th was a Sunday, not Shabbat), then Yeshua would have been in the grave part of Thursday, all day Friday and all day Shabbat (satisfying the Hebrew criteria for 3 days), plus all night Thursday night, all night Friday night and (if he rose just after sundown at the end of Shabbat, which is feasible since that is when the priests went across the Kidron valley to the Mt of Olives to harvest the barley for First Fruits) part of Saturday night, satisfying the 3 nights.
Cleopas would then be correct, from a Greek point of view, in saying that “this is the third day since these things have happened”.
This raises another problem though – when did the women go out to buy the spices for the proper burial ritual, since now the 15th (the High Sabbath of the First Day of Unleavened Bread) is the Friday and immediately precedes the normal weekly Shabbat. This leaves no time for either purchasing or preparing the spices since they would have had to rest on 2 consecutive days.
So, it seems the “possible” solution doesn’t work out, after all. Which leads to two possibilities; either we still have a language problem or Cleopas couldn’t count (or maybe he was just so disturbed by what was going on that he got his days mixed up).
Back to the drawing board…:-)
Grrr. that pesky /i tag got messed up again (I probably typed i/ somewhere instead…)
I think I found it…
the word “today” means “night current” or “just passed”
G4594 σήμεÏον semeron (say’-mer-on) adv.
1. on the (i.e. this) day (or night current or just passed)
2. (generally) now (i.e. at present, hitherto)
[neuter (as adverb) of a presumed compound of the article G3588 (t changed to s) and G2250]
KJV: this (to-)day
The word means current night or JUST PASSED. Which would mean it it was the first day with 3 days & 3 nights in between the events, namely the death and the account being discussed regarding the tomb being discovered empty.
In essence, “last night which just ended as it is now the morning of the first day…was three days and three nights”
That sounds right, just taking it back in time. Yeah, I see that.
The truth that Cleopas knew of the events make it even more hilarious that Messiah is standing there eye to eye, shoulder to shoulder, so to speak, and he was still veiled. Humbling
praise Yahoshua!
Thanks, Scot. Like I said, just a problem with understanding
. I was concentrating on the wrong word. It just proves that in order to get the right answer, you have to ask the right questions…:-)
Rodney,
Where did you say you lived again? I forgot.
Adelaide, South Australia. Down Under
I made some homeade Matza and it was great!! Its 100 times better than that stuff from the box. Especially when its fresh and hot YUM!!
Thanks for all the recipes and information guys!!
Did anyone else hear Holisa Alewine on GLC this past week? This was the topic: from Genesis to Revelation, Who are these? Rachael, sons, daughters, Pasach, suffer, Sukkot, celebrate, rewards. Praise Abba!
Holisa Alewine’s teaching on “The Creation Gospel” is a real eye-opener, tying together the 7 Spirits of God, the 7 Days of Creation, the 7 Feasts of The Lord and 7 Churches in Revelation, all through the symbolism of the menorah.
Rodney,
I did not know that! I thought for sure you were from the Pacific Northwest…Holly & Alan are good friends of ours…
Menorah,
I wish I had you here. I am having a tough time with some carpentry.
Hi Rodney,
Please send me the link to watch Holisa Alewine, I couldn’t find her on GLC.
Warm greetings to you and to your wife
serafima
Serafima, you’ll find some of her videos online at http://www.israelnet.tv. The Creation Gospel teaching is available on 2 DVD’s (I don’t remember if it was from their site or someone elses, I’ll try to check back) and 3 workbooks that go with them that are really useful references. I’ve lent mine to a local pastor but should get them back soon(ish).
Scott, there seems to be a real lack of Messianic Torah teachers down-under. I rely on the internet for pretty much all of my learning (praise Yah for technology). Even so, God has been good and he’s been pouring on the revelation from multiple sources, all of which are building up to something. I’m excited by how open a couple of key leaders are at the church we’re currently part of; I met with one of the elders for coffee today and had a fantastic time for nearly 2 hours, explaining (briefly) about the Feasts, in some depth re current events and prophecy, and explained the pagan origins of Easter (which he had never heard before). His question was, “How did THAT get into the CHURCH?”
The reason he’s so open is because the stuff I’m telling him is confirming stuff that he’s getting from other, well connected (non-Messianic) sources as well as the scriptures God has been impressing on him in his own study. God is GOOD!
Tomorrow morning I’m having breakfast with the pastor. He’s also open (although more cautiously) so please pray that God will give him a revelation he can’t ignore. I’m going to give him copies of Brad Scott’s Hebrew vs Greek Thought and Bricks vs Stones sessions from the Final Return conference, as well as Bill Cloud’s The Two Shall Become One. He had a word from God early in the (gregorian) new year about 2010 being a year of Restoration. He just doesn’t realize fully yet what God is restoring to His people
.
In case you’re wondering, yes, I’m excited by what God is doing.
BTW, thanks for your greetings, Serafima
. I believe Laura did eventually contact you via email? Thanks for the photos, too. Blessings to you and yours.
Thank you Rodney
Yes, Laura contacted me and we had a nice change of messages and she is so sweet. Your boys are great! How wonderful Yhwh blessed all of you!
Prays Him!
Thank you for your posts, they are realy useful!
serafima
Rodney,
I had the General Session at The Final Return Conference on Sunday and a breakout session before and afterward with standing room only. They were bringing in chairs the whole time I was teaching and several folks were sitting on the floor. People are hungry.
There are elements that would seek to silence the scriptures with regard to what they deem to be “tough to swallow.” It is ERROR through and through.
I am only going to be able to hold my water for a little while longer to some of the false teachings currently being propagated by some “messianics” who are about to be swept off of their feet as the wave of mediocrity crashes. In many (and in some circles most) cases, the average guy in the audience is more informed than the one behind the pulpit. I am speaking concering ancient history and the origins of man as well as the strong delusion of the sons of god\fallen messengers from above.
I am happy for your friend, concerned that he might be confused by some of the materials you would give him.
Thanks, Scot. I’m careful what I pass on at this stage – usually only that which I believe will a) be helpful to their understanding (having a pretty good idea of where they’re currently at) and b) I feel prompted by the Spirit to pass on.
Just like you can’t feed a baby meat, the same goes with feeding Torah and prophecy to people who have never heard it. They’ll choke on it or spit it out and get no nutrition from it. They need milk, then mash, then vegies with a (very) little meat chopped up into tiny pieces, then slowly as they can learn to chew and digest it, increase size of the pieces, the size of the portions and the quantity of (clean) meat.
It has taken me some years to figure this out (I think that’s part of the process of maturing and hopefully growing in wisdom). God can accelerate the process, but that has to be Him bringing the revelation and conviction as He sees they can deal with it.
BTW, I have the full set of DVD’s from The Final Return, but so far I’ve only watched Brad’s 2 general sessions and the one from Bill Cloud. Looking forward to the rest…
Rodney,
Do you know if there’s a way/link I can download the Final Return from or at least part of it? It looks like it was a great experience. It’s pretty “dead” here too in the LA area, not many like-minded believers, it’s tough, we miss fellowship, teachings, singing, etc.
Bill preached perhaps the best message I have heard him preach. I was encouraged by his candid delivery. Bill has been going through some personal stuff and I think it has really caused him to loosen up a bit. I was blessed by his teaching in Dallas. He spoke “off the cuff” and it was obvious that he was being led by the Spirit and in tune with what people needed to hear about our own families. I don’t really even think he prepared to teach in that manner.
I spoke regarding Syria, Islam & AC in the general session and overshot my time by 20+ minutes but people were starving. During the breakout session that followed it was packed and was just a large Q&A. Some people gave testimony and a lot of hearts were touched. People are scared and those that are YHWH’s know that we as a people deserve the judgment that is coming and that is a fearful thing.
There are elements within the messianic community that are “riding the fence” and painting a prettier picture about the future and I believe that to be disgusting…wish it wasn’t so. Fortunately, Bill is NOT one of them.
Many people have downloads of video and such, though most do not. Some don’t because they don’t know how, most think they are protecting their business interests. It shouldn’t be, but it is. I don’t know it is available or not. Some of it was at some point, previously.
Larry,
The DVD’s are available from Jim Staley’s web site (http://www.passionfortruth.com) if they have any left. They only did a limited production run and I’m not sure if they’ve all sold. You could email Pam (use the contact form on their web site) and ask if they’re still available or if they’re going to do more.
If they’re no longer available, since I have the full set I’ll see if I can get permission to make them available for streaming, either via YouTube or my own web site (still under construction).
Rodney,
Thanks, I know their site. I meant for free as a download. I’m pretty sure you could rip those DVD’s. Had I known in advance, I would’ve recorded the whole thing when they were streaming it live. I agree with Scot about having free downloads available.
Shabbat shalom,
Bill Cloud is going to be in our hometown ( Meridian, Ms.) for a couple of nights week after next. May Abba’s will be done in Y’shuas’ name, amen.
Thanksgiving!
Larry,
Send me a mailing address to jds6958@gmail.com and I will send you a copy.
Right now, PFT streams all of the audio teachings for free, but all video productions have not yet made it online for free.
We have got some priority things up on youtube, like the Church Audit…but the Final Return is like a 12 disk beast…LOL
Rodney, check with Pam, but I can not imagine PFT not wanting all of it on YouTube, or somewhere else for free.
Blessings,
-jon
Thanks, Jon. Yes, I will check with Pam. I have spare space on my web hosting account and 10GB/month bandwidth, of which almost none is being used at the moment (because I’m only updating my blog every couple of weeks and so far I think only one other person is reading it)
Shabbat Shalom, everyone. I got the OK from Jim and Pam to upload the Final Return videos to my web site. I’ll let you all know when they’re up there and ready to go (a few days – I’ve almost got them all converted and ready to upload).
test
[b]test[/b]
jds,
Use < and > instead of [ and ] with the obligatory /b or /i in the closing code.
Recipes for unleaven cakes, cookies, crackers etc
http://www.giveshare.org/HolyDay/fubrecipies.html
I copied this from something that I posted on another forum.
Understanding the Festival of Unleavened Bread and Leaven
This discussion is to discuss just what leaven was to the ancient Hebrews. When this is properly understood, then more significance will come from keeping the festival of unleavened bread. I will copy and paste some comments from another discussion, and then elaborate on them.
It will become obvious how this applies at the end.
Luci said to me (when she found out I was learning to make sourdough bread),
"I have a lovely starter my mother sent me from Montana that has been kept alive since coming from the gold rush days in California. It came through a Yellowstone ranger, then to a lovely artisan bread making family in Bozeman. It smells so appley and delicious, I am making some bread right now. It has a 7 hour rise time. Wow, will that be good. I am willing to share some if you want to pay shipping.
"
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First of all we need to understand that the Hebrews did not just go down to the local market and buy some packets of yeast when they wanted to make bread. Commercial yeast as we know it, has only been available for less than 200 years. How did people rise their bread before this? They used what we refer to today as a sourdough starter.
Here is a brief run down on how to create a sourdough starter of your own:
1) obtain some grains of wheat.
2) grind the wheat
3) place the fresh flour, just a few tablespoons, in a container and add some water
4) wait about a day
5) add a bit more flour and water, wait another day
Here is a look at what will be happening…The grains of wheat have naturally occurring yeast on their surface, there may be many varieties of yeasts and other beasties on this wheat. When it is ground and water is added the yeast will start to feed on the starch present in the flour. Actually the first thing that starts to grow are usually bacteria.
After about a day, you will probably start to notice some bubbles forming in the runny dough mixture. This is in part from wild yeast, but at this point mostly bacteria. Each day you will add a bit of flour to continue feeding your future slaves (yes the yeast will be your slaves, they will be working for you, you must feed and nourish them so they will grow into a multitude).
The Land of Goshen
Just as Joseph gave his family the land of Goshen, the place where he knew they would prosper, the very best of the land, so we too must give the yeast the very best of living conditions. Just as the Egyptians thought that the Hebrew shepherds were detestable and did not want to live in the same area, so too is the dichotomy between the yeasts and the bacteria. We must create good conditions for the yeast, they will become greater in number, a multitude, and the bacteria will become less in number. This can be done in the start by using some fruit juice instead of water to add to the flour mixture. The yeast thrive in an acid environment and they will start to over power the bacteria.
One of the points of this discussion is to show that there is a big difference between leaven and yeast, at least this is what I am learning from my experience with making a sour dough starter.
As you continue to add a bit of flour and juice each day to the mix, the yeast will start to really come to life, the smell of the mixture will start to have a bread or wine smell, there will be that definite "yeast smell" that you get from beer, wine and bread dough. At this point you can just add water because the yeast themselves now, being strong in number, will make their environment acidic on their own. The bacteria will have now been overpowered by the yeast. The only bacteria left will be several varieties of lacto-bacillus, which are bacteria that thrive in an acid environment, actually producing lactic acid, which acts as a preservative, and protects from harmful bacteria. Doesn’t this sound like how the Hebrews almost took over the land of Goshen?
When will you be able to make bread?
Once your starter gets going, after about 3-4 days, you then will remove about half the mix each day and discard it. Lets say that you have 2 cups of starter…You will remove one cup, discard it, and then add enough flour and water to get it back up to 2 cups. At this point the yeast will gradually become stronger and stronger, but you still can not make bread yet, therefore you do not yet possess "leaven" (imo). What will start to happen soon is that your dough lump will start to grow. It should double in volume in about 12-24 hours, when it doubles in volume you will remove half and discard it, and again add enough flour and water to get it back to the original volume.
What you are doing here is feeding your yeast. Just like Joseph fed his family in Egypt. As the yeast multiply they are consuming the nutrients in the mix, so you need to constantly add more flour to feed your future slaves. The reason you remove half each time is because, if you didn’t, you would soon have an Olympic sized swimming pool full of sour dough starter, as it would be doubling in size each day!
So how long before the yeast colony is strong enough to make bread? About one week. Once a week has passed you MAY have what could be called leaven. You MAY actually be able to make some leavened bread.
The Process of Bread Making
I am no expert on bread making, but I am trying to learn. The book of Exodus mentions kneading troughs. These would be a concave trough or long shallow bowl made out of wood that they would have kept their sour dough starter in and also they would mix their dough in it.
Now imagine you are a Hebrew and you now have a viable starter in your kneading trough. You know it is ready to bake bread with because when you feed it, it will double back to its original size in about 7-12 hours. Now it is time to bake bread, you no longer have to throw out any of your mix. What you do is take your starter mix, and add to that enough ingredients to make your bread for the day, your daily bread. The starter you added to these ingredients will now have a field day and start to grow like crazy, and in the process they will be making lots of CO2 which will fluff up your dough. This may take a while longer than store bought yeast, but the job will get done. If they mixed their dough in the evening, it would be risen and ready to bake in the cool of the morning.
When the dough for the bread is made, you keep back some of the dough for the next day, and bake your bread with the rest. Now you have started a process where by each day you make bread, and keep some left over sourdough for the next day. Your starter, your LEAVEN, has become like a family pet, and a good starter can be almost as prized as a faithful family pet, maybe MORE prized than Rover.
So in my opinion, leaven is a functional lump of sourdough starter, it is not the same as wild yeast. Now what we might have in the cupboard, for us is leaven, because we can use it to make a loaf of leavened bread the same day, but it is nowhere near as prized as the leaven of the Hebrews. Their leaven had to be fed and nurtured in order to become strong! Their leaven took a minimum of a week to be made functional. When they threw out their prized starter lump, and it was prized, shared, traded, and loved, they would be very sad to do so. They may have spent a good part of the year developing the character that their starter (leaven) now had. This may be why the Festival of Unleavened Bread would last a week, because it would be impossible to make leavened bread again for at least a week. When the festival was over, they did not go down to the store to buy some packets of yeast, but their new lump would be almost ready now to be called leaven again.
————————————————————-
Just like keeping the Passover by actually killing a lamb, may give us more of an appreciation of what YHWH and Y’shua did for us, I think that we should all try to start a sour dough starter. It may help us to really appreciate the fact that the "leaven" of the Pharisees was something that had to be fed and nurtured.
What I think this is really pointing at is that we are to abandon our own "nurtured and fed beliefs" each year. We are to go back to the source, the Torah, read it and get some seeds/spores of truth. We are then to feed and nurture these ideas from the source into our beliefs. Just as each year the Israelites were to throw away their PRIZED leaven, that had developed some very nice characteristics, and start fresh, they were to go back to the source, the wild yeast, to nurture and feed a new lump, so we too have to be willing to abandon our "prized teachings" that have been shared and passed down for years. Perhaps we have developed ideas of our own that are prized in our eyes, each year we should abandon everything, and go back to the Torah, the source of our knowledge and wisdom, then we will get fresh insight, and our ideas will again be based on Torah.
Those who are experienced in making fine starters (leaven) may know a few tricks and things to add to improve the flavor; they will not take as long to once again have a fine lump of leaven.
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Each year during the Festival of Unleavened bread, we need to go back to the Torah. Read only in the Torah all week long, abandoning our existing ideas and making sure all our beliefs are from the true source, Torah.
Next I’ll add a word study on leaven.
—————————————————————
Below is the Hebrew word that is translated as the English word leaven.
H7603
שׂ×ר
Å›e’ôr
seh-ore’
From H7604; barm or yeast cake (as swelling by fermentation): – leaven.
Below is the root it comes from.
H7604
ש××ר
shâ’ar
shaw-ar’
A primitive root; properly to swell up, that is, be (causatively make) redundant: – leave, (be) left, let, remain, remnant, reserve, the rest.
Do you see how the Hebrew letters are the same for both. The only difference are the vowel pointings, which were not present in the original text. Therefore one had to discern which word to use by the context. The roots though, will always have a related meaning.
So how is "swelling by fermentation" related to "left over, or remaining"? In our western understanding of leaven this makes no sense what so ever, but in the Hebrew understanding of leaven, the relationship is very obvious. The word leaven comes from the root left over because you always make sure to have some of your leaven left over for your next batch of bread!
Now if we do a word search for H7604, the root of leaven, "a left over" lets see what comes up.
Gen 7:23 So He wiped off all that stand, which were on the face of the ground – both man and beast, creeping creature and bird of the heavens. And they were wiped off from the earth. And only Noaḥ was left [Noah was the leaven left to start a new beginning (loaf)], and those with him in the ark.
Gen 32:8 and he said, “If Äšsaw comes to the one group and attacks it, then the other group which is left shall escape.†(If part of Jacob’s family was destroyed, there would be some left over, some leaven, to begin again)
Gen 42:38 But he said, “My son is not going down with you, for his brother is dead, and he is left alone. If any harm should come to him along the way in which you go, then you would bring down my grey hair with sorrow to the grave.â€Â (the sons of Rachel have been divided, and in Jacobs mind one half had been destroyed, he did not want to part with what was left over)
It is obvious to see the connection here. leaven is always left over in part when you bake bread, so that you can continue to bake daily. Leaven does not represent sin, but it represents something that has been fed, nourished and cherished. Leaven represents our ideas and teachings that we feed, nourish, cherish, and share with others. The great sin of the Pharisees was that they refused to let go of their own teachings each year, and go back to Torah. Their teachings gradually grew into something of their very own with very different characteristics than what they originally got from the scriptures. They had in effect broken the Festival of Unleavened Bread in a spiritual sense for many many years. That is why Y’shua warned to avoid the leaven of the Pharisees. It was not that leaven was bad or sinful, but that the Pharisee’s leaven, or prized teachings had strayed way too far from the Torah.
Y’shua’s leaven or teachings were straight from the Torah. He constantly returned to the source, the Torah, the "wild yeast", to form his teachings, HIS leaven.
——————————————
Now let me alter Luci’s comments she sent me…
I have a lovely starter [teaching] my mother sent me from Montana that has been kept alive since coming from the gold rush days in California. It came through a Yellowstone ranger, then to a lovely artisan bread making family in Bozeman [there is a long tradition conected to this "teaching"]. It smells so appley and delicious[this teaching is appealing to almost everyone], I am making some bread right now [I'm applying this teaching in my life right now]. It has a 7 hour rise time [This teaching was put on to a 7 hour DVD set, I'm sure this teaching will have good effects in my life].Wow, will that be good. I am willing to share some if you want to pay shipping [I'll send you a copy of this DVD set if you pay the shipping].
Â
Shalom,
Â
Greg
Ha! That was awesome! Thanks for posting that bro! Shabbat Shalom family!
Mar 15:33 And when the sixth hour was come, there was darkness over the whole land until the ninth hour.
I read thru this blog and did not see any mention of the above verse.Anyone have an explanation for darkness that came over the land when our King was tortured on the cross?
Here is a portion of an explanation of this event. Anyone have any comments?
This was not a natural solar eclipse, for astronomers have charted all the lunar and solar eclipses visible in the Middle East for the past 5,000 years. In fact, since Passover always fell on a full moon, it was impossible to have a solar eclipse at Passover, for solar eclipses can occur only at the time of the new moon (that is, when no moon appears in the sky at night). Likewise, eclipses of the moon are seen only at the time of the full moon. And so, while there have been lunar eclipses at Passover on occasion throughout history, there has never been a natural solar eclipse on that day. The darkness that fell over the land at noon during the time Jesus hung on the cross was supernatural, not natural.
Astronomers tell us that in the late afternoon of Passover, Friday, April 3, 33 A.D., while Joseph of Arimathea and Nicodemus were hurrying to bury the body of Jesus, there was also a lunar eclipse. The eclipse began in Europe at 3:01 p.m. when Jesus died, and it was already eclipsed when the moon rose over Jerusalem at 5:10 p.m. that evening.
It is impossible to have a lunar eclipse and a solar eclipse on the same day, because the sun and the moon must be in opposite positions in the sky for these two kinds of eclipses. Yet on this great day in history, God marked the time for all to see by a spectacular miracle.
If you want to more of the writing go to
http://seeingwhatyoubelieve.blogspot.com/2007/12/why-did-jesus-die-at-301-pm.html
Greg with that software of yours can you go back in time and see anything about this in the heavens?
The answer is yes Kirt. I just now had time to check this out. I went to a predicted future date of a total lunar eclipse over Jerusalem. The date is the full moon marking the start of Sukkot 2015. The full moon rises on Sept 27, and becomes fully eclipsed shortly before dawn on the 28th. This is a very special full moon as it is the forth total lunar eclipse in a row. When it is quite rare to have four total lunar eclipses in a row. When this happens it is called a tetrad. Sometimes hundreds of years can pass between tetrads. It just so happens that there are 8 this century, which is extremely rare. The upcoming tetrad consists of two total lunar eclipses in 2014 and two in 2015. Here is the interesting part…They occur on Passover 2014, Sukkot 2014, Passover 2015 and Sukkot 2015. All will be visible from the US and Canada, but only the last one will be visible from Jerusalem. Below is a screen shot from Stellarium. Please note that you must set your computers timezone to GMT +2 (Jerusalem time) to see the eclipse at the right time. You must also have it set for the right viewing area.
If you want to check times of past and future eclipses NASA is a great resource.
The eclipse mentioned in the article you highlighted was only a partial eclipse. Probably not worth mentioning in scripture. I think the darkness from the 6th to the 9th hour was caused by something other than an eclipse.
I checked the date of April 3 33 CE and the moon rose full and uneclipsed over Jerusalem, but started a partial eclipse at about 6:20. The moon was not more than half eclipsed, and by 8:20 it was back to normal.
I did not realize that Jonah had actually been dead before swallowed up by the whale. His body was preserved in the whale. While his soul was soul went to Sheol. Which makes Jonah’s 3 days and 3 nights death an even stronger parallel to Yahshua’s.
Mat 12:40 For as Jonas WAS THREE DAYS AND THREE NIGHTS in the whale’s belly; so shall the SON OF MAN BE THREE DAYS AND THREE NIGHTS IN THE HEART OF THE EARTH.
Mat 16:4 A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; AND THERE SHALL NO SIGN BE GIVEN UNTO IT, BUT THE SIGN OF THE PROPHET JONAS. And he left them, and departed
Jon 1:17 Now Yahweh had prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights.
Jon 2:2 And said, I cried by reason of mine affliction unto Yahweh, and he heard me; out of the belly of HELL cried I, and thou heardest my voice.
Notice the verse doesn’t say the belly of the whale but the belly of Hell.
For further support of Jonah dying and not actually living in the whale go to
http://www.letusreason.org/Biblexp94.htm
That makes a lot of sense Kirt. I often wondered how he could be kept alive inside the fish. Obviously either way there is a miracle involved, but your suggestion makes sense. It could also be a point on Larry’s side in the discussion on whether or not it is possible to be conscious in Sheol (not hell or heaven as the church promotes, but the grave).
A light look at a modern day Passover.